Better pic of the GIANT Redear..

Comment

Comment by Tony Livingston on February 19, 2014 at 1:46pm

Hmmm......Was this fish participating in a management plan of any sort, Carl?? If so, I would probably fall over in a slump, weep despondently, and rend my garments while pouring ashes on my head. The exact same things I might do if the fish came from an unmanaged BOW. ;)

Comment by carl hendrix on February 19, 2014 at 1:16pm

well-- lets have some fun on the reverse side!  WHAT IF!!!  you hooked one like this;;   got it to the boat;; reached out; with either hand or net;;   you see what a monster gill  it is;;  and in a flash-- it flips - twists- and gets  UNHOOKED!!  seeing your trophy -- slowly swimming away;; and as a gesture- from the giant gill-- flips its tail at you and splashes you in the face!!  as if to say-- im not that easy big guy!!   LORD OF THE FLYRODS  a little help here; if you don't mind your lordship;; put it in a more poetic way!!!!

Comment by David, aka, "McScruff" on February 19, 2014 at 12:23pm

But, I like thinking! (It does make my head hurt, though).

Okay, nice fish.

Comment by Tony Livingston on February 19, 2014 at 11:53am

There ya go Tooty!... I couldn't agree more. A trophy is a trophy, irregardless. There shouldn't be varying degrees of "trophydom"

I would love to have the chance to fish Havasu, even if I didn't tie into a biggun.

Well done Hector!!

Comment by DAVID L EITUTIS on February 19, 2014 at 11:36am

PEOPLE JUST PLAIN THINK TOO MUCH!!!!!!! GREAT FISH IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCE AND I DON'T CARE IF THEY ARE FEEDING EM STEROIDS !!!! ANY WAY YA SLICE IT , IT ALWAYS COMES OUT THE SAME. "TROPHY" ...........

Comment by Tony Livingston on February 19, 2014 at 10:26am

Alright, for the sake of discussion I offer up the following:

It appears that the sticking point revolves around an action being either deliberate, or accidental. I pose the following questions, and ask that they be reviewed carefully, and answered honestly.

1) Hypothetically speaking......it becomes known that the Quagga mussel infestation was not in fact an accident, but was a deliberate action performed by someone "in the know" regarding shellcrackers, and their food preferences. Now, what is the opinion of these giant, public water redears?

2) Hypothetically speaking....the circumstances as we now understand them remain the same, (accidental introduction of quagga's, etc), but havasu is not a public BOW, but a private lake inaccessible to the general public. What say you now? Is the catch still worthy of the same level of admiration, even if the person who caught it is the only guy allowed to fish there?

I think there could be an element we haven't touched on up until this point. It seems to me that a lot may be overlooked and forgiven, if the BOW in question is open to everyone irregardless of management or lack thereof.

Comment by David, aka, "McScruff" on February 19, 2014 at 10:03am

"It doesn't matter if the plant was introduced intentionally, or the quagga mussels accidentally, both are a form of management, and both are a one-time deal."

I'll have to disagree in the main. Accidental introduction is NOT management.

It produces an effect, yes.

And it can BE managed after the fact.

But if it is not done by design, then the two variables - fish and mussels - musn't be said to be part of a managed scheme.

"...the inescapable conclusion is that those fish would not be growing to these sizes had man not become involved."

You are 100% right, here. If we want to grind this down to its' finest point (and don't we LOVE to?), it is the ACTIVITIES of man that have had this serendipitous effect. Since every card game is a deliberate affair, that is as far as "the hand of man" card can be played here.

"Deliberate," is the operative concept. Since the mussels were not deliberately introduced for the purpose of creating a particular effect - big red ear, in this instance - we must only go so far as to call it a happy accident. Will there now be a deliberate program at Havasu to ensure a steady stream of these leviathans?

It has happened elsewhere....

(I still suspect Galbraiths of having a farm tank out back and a secret enclosure in the lake, nearby....LOL)

Comment by Tony Livingston on February 19, 2014 at 9:42am

"Agreed. A fish not "managed" to a purpose is another thing altogether."

I'll buy that. Now suppose we take this to it's next hypothetical step.....having a lake that produces world record redears is bound to be good for business, tourism and fishing related. Recognizing the fact that those record fish exist strictly due to an unforseen chain of events, (quagga mussels and weed eradication), the powers that be decide that weed eradication needs to be performed more aggressively, and regularly, in the hopes of continuing the string of giant fish.

Now where do we stand? Now they are managing for those giant redears, not by feeding, but by manipulating their environment in a fashion to hopefully allow things to continue on as they were.

Managing, is far more than throwing food out regularly. Take Tilapia for example. They're vegetarians, grazers. Say I introduce a particular plant into the water, and this plant reproduces itself and feeds all my tilapia, without me ever having to add any further feed of any kind. Is this management, even though it was a one time effort on my part? Yes it is.

It doesn't matter if the plant was introduced intentionally, or the quagga mussels accidentally, both are a form of management, and both are a one-time deal.

Those redears grew large due to an accident, and an intentional action. Neither was orchestrated for the benefit of the redears, but the inescapable conclusion is that those fish would not be growing to these sizes had man not become involved.

Comment by David, aka, "McScruff" on February 19, 2014 at 9:31am

"I would wager that a truly natural fish would be pretty hard to come by....a fish untouched in any fashion by the hand of man."

Agreed, 100%.

A fish not "managed," however, in a cloistered, closed environment as part of a determined and purposeful result.... well that is another thing altogether. Those we CAN come by.

In this case, that is NOT what we are seeing. And that was my point, at least.

Comment by Tony Livingston on February 19, 2014 at 8:58am

How did the mussels get into Havasu? Those cards that mother nature is playing were dealt by the hand of man....

What about where you fish LOFR? Were your waters, or are your waters, ever stocked with forage? (minnows, shad, etc)  And what about the weedkill at Havasu that enabled those RES to feed on the mussels....that wasn't natural either.

It doesn't matter if you zip open a bag of fishfood, or add a biological source of forage...either way you are manipulating the environment, altering the environment, managing the environment. I would wager that a truly natural fish would be pretty hard to come by....a fish untouched in any fashion by the hand of man.

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